Herbs, Womb Wisdom, and a 20-Year Herbal Journey with Clinical Herbalist Kay'aleya Hunnybee

🌿 What if the plants around you could completely transform your health and life? In this episode of The Herbalist’s Path, clinical herbalist Kay’aleya Hunnybee shares her 20-year journey with herbs, from her first transformative experiences with Tulsi tea in India to using plants to quit smoking and empowering women’s health with herbal wisdom. You’ll leave feeling inspired to deepen your connection with nature and confident in exploring how plants can enrich your well-being.

🎧 What’s in this episode:

• 02:10 Kay’aleya’s first encounter with herbs in India
• 10:24 Quitting smoking with herbal blends
• 20:15 The magic of Tulsi and connecting with plants
• 32:45 Kay’aleya’s journey into clinical herbalism
• 45:00 How herbalism empowers women’s health

📌 For full show notes, resources, and links go HERE.

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Chapters

• 1:50 Journey Into Herbalism and Women's Health
• 14:56 Herbalist's Journey and Plant Medicine
• 26:38 Learning Herbalism With Elder Herbalist
• 34:50 The Herbal Journey Through Midwifery
• 44:33 The Evolution of Herbal Education
• 49:51 Diverse Paths in Herbal Education
• 55:51 Never-Ending Herbal Learning Journey
• 1:08:01 Herbalist Path Etiquette and Disclaimer

Transcript

Speaker 1: 1:51

Hello and welcome to the Herbalist Path, a podcast where you'll discover how to make your own herbal remedies at home so that you can take better care of yourself, better care of your family and better care of our planet. I'm Mel. I'm a clinical herbalist, environmental educator and mountain-l living mama with this crazy passion for teaching more mamas and their little loves how to use plants as medicine in a safe, effective and tasty way, so that there can be an herbalist in every home. Again, it's an absolute honor to have you on the journey down the herbalist path with me so that together we can make herbalism Hashtag spread like wildflowers. Hello, hello and welcome back to another episode on the herbalist path. I am really excited for today's show and for this amazing guest that I am about to have on with you. It's Kayla. I always say your name wrong. Say it for me. I'm gonna have to do this. I meant to say that before I started the recording read it when you read it.

Speaker 1: 3:10

Okay, I get it okay, I'm gonna start that again, rose. Hello, hello and welcome back to another episode on the herbalist path. I am so incredibly excited to introduce to you today's guest, kayaela Haribi, a brilliant clinical herbalist and integrative health practitioner that specializes in women's health, so women's sexual and hormonal health and menstrual health for all those that menstruate. And she is this amazing being. Even though every time I say her first name, I butcher it for some reason, it's not a lack of love or respect for the amazing work that she does. She also is an educator and teaches people all about various aspects of women's health and hormones. She is also the podcast host at Womb Wisdom, the Herbal Womb Wisdom podcast. Man, I am butchering your intro and I kind of like do it again. Holy crap.

Speaker 1: 4:28

I'm trying to like speak and it's not working. It's so funny. My friend just sent me this reel and it's hilarious. It's so funny. My friend just sent me this real. It's hilarious. I feel like I need to send it to you now. But it's like me and perimenopause how I feel like I'm talking in this conversation but what's really coming out and the lady's like that's what I'm doing right now. So, um, thank you, kylea, kylea, kylea. Um, okay, hello, hello.

Speaker 1: 5:00

Welcome to another episode on the herbalist path. I am very, very, very excited to introduce to you my guest today, kylea honeybee. She is a fellow clinical herbalist and an integrative health practitioner. She really specializes in women's health care, particularly around hormonal health and sexual health and menstrual health for all of us who menstruate. She's like this beautiful soul, which I don't even need to tell you because you're going to listen to the episode and feel that from her. She is also the host of the Herbal Womb Wisdom podcast and she will be one of our special guest educators inside of our community herbalist program. And gosh, yeah, I'm just so excited to finally connect with you on this podcast. We've been trying it for so long but life kept happening and we kept having to reschedule. So thank you so much for being here and welcome to the Earless Path.

Speaker 2: 6:07

Yay, thank you for welcoming me. Thank you for inviting me and welcoming me and, yeah, it's such an honor to be here.

Speaker 1: 6:12

Yeah, it's great to connect with you, I know. Finally. Well, let's get started. One thing I always love to hear about and I know I'm going to love hearing about it from you is just how you first got into the world of herbs and plant medicine. Like what, where did that stem from for you?

Speaker 2: 6:37

This is always such a big question to answer because there's different, there's different paths, right? That got me here. Um, what I think that I'll speak to is a couple of things. Okay, so when I was in India I went to India in 2003 and I encountered people working with herbs regularly, like it was just something that was happening, right, and one of the things that one of the facilitators did now, I didn't realize people were herbalists or and there was anything like that at the time but one of the things that the facilitators did was actually encourage us to take neem regularly, which I was just like wait, I don't know what that is, but they're telling me to take it. So I just started taking it. So I was taking it actually every single day when I was there and they were like this is going to help you with any like weird water you're drinking or like things you're touching, and you know, I was living pretty low key in India and this was my study abroad program when I was in college and I was just kind of like, okay, cool, so I did, I took it while I was there.

Speaker 2: 7:35

I actually didn't get until I don't need to tell the whole story about that until a very particular episode where I had like a really massive health journey. Until then, for like months, I didn't get sick at all and I was all over the place Like and you know, I don't know how many people who are listening have been to different places in India. I was in Southern India and, yeah, I mean I was. I was encountering a lot of dirty water, I will tell you that and so it's pretty amazing to me that I was like doing as well as I would. I never, I never thought about that. Like when I was there I didn't think about that, but when I think back, I'm like that's the first time that I like used herbal medicine regularly. That was like actually a part of my life. So I think about that.

Speaker 2: 8:16

And then I also think about how I was volunteering on a farm. When I was volunteering on this biodynamic farm and actually a lot of the time in India you have chai right Like chai is on there's stalls all over the place, and at this farm and I was was I was a pretty significant caffeine addict at the time. That was like an important thing for me, so I was like oh hi, yay, this is so awesome. It's everywhere. So I was always excited about that.

Speaker 2: 8:43

So when we would have breaks on the farm, we would often have chai and I'd be like, oh great, like it's gonna energize me, I'm gonna feel good. And then sometimes they would have this other tea and they wouldn't have an option for chai and I'd be like, oh no, I can't, like. I just like this is not going to be able to support me through the rest of my day. And what I learned later was that was Tulsi, that was Tulsi tea that we would have and it actually I remember the feeling it was always the women who brought it over and it was like, not the dudes, it was the women who brought it over and there was this experience of us all connecting. There was like this opening to our hearts and I did feel energized and in some ways I think I even felt more energized than when I took had the chai. It was more, more like this uplifting feeling, more balanced, feeling more good. I just knew I liked it. So now, when I look back at that, I'm like, oh, that's where my first awareness is, even though I didn't have the awareness of like this is herbal medicine and I'm going on this path. It's where my first awareness is of like herbs were in my life and they were just a part of what I was doing and I was noticing their effects.

Speaker 2: 9:50

So then fast forward. Like finished college a couple years later and I was volunteering on actually in Oregon and you're in your neck of the woods down in Cottage Grove, I was at a sustainability education and research center. I had no money at the time, I was doing a lot of work trading around the country and it was called Apparato I don't know if you've heard of that, but Apparato and I was there for months and I was. I would go on this walk in the woods like pretty much every day. I was on a trail and I just got used to the walk and eventually one of the people who worked there was like I'm going to lead a plant walk and I was just like what's a plant walk?

Speaker 2: 10:24

Like I have no idea what that is but, I will come with you and I knew that she kind of like made herbal medicines, but she didn't talk about it like that. You know, I just knew that that was something she was doing on the side. And we're going on this walk and she and she's introducing us to plants along the way, plants that I have been walking by for months, like daily seeing, just seeing plant bush tree, you know, like that's what my brain was doing. And she's like and this is Oregon grape, and you can actually you know that's what my brain was doing. And she's like and this is oregon grape, and you can actually you know, like this is and this is the way she's like harvest some. She, like you know, uses her little knife to to take some off. She's like this is the yellow part, this is the medicine. She's like telling us about what these different plants offer and I'm just like, are you? My mind was truly blown like this concept, not only that, yes, like some plants can be medicinal, like I think I knew a little bit about that in the garden, like that we could grow some plants that might be medicinal, but that these plants that I was walking by every day, that lived wild around us had medicine that we could have relationship with, like, like it was, I don't know whatever I perceived as reality before. That was entirely different after that walk. So I immediately came back. She told us like basic idea around making a folk tincture. I immediately came back, I went and harvested Oregon grape. What else did I harvest? I think I harvested some raspberry leaf, I mean it just harvested like a bunch of the things that she had mentioned and I made tinctures, like I literally within two hours had made my first folk tinctures, because I was just like this is insane, why do not more people not know about this? So I was honestly on the plant path from the moment that I learned that medicinal plants were just living around us onward. So that was the very beginning for me. Yeah, that was my first initiation. I will say that at that point I also. So we had a library there.

Speaker 2: 12:23

I was a smoker at the time. I was a tobacco smoker at the time and at that point I had graduated to rolling my own. You were living in Oregon but, and you know, of course people roll their cigarettes with other. You know cannabis too sometimes, but that's not what. That wasn't really my deal. I was just actually addicted to tobacco and I had been addicted to tobacco for many years. And so, um, at that time I was, I actually found Howie Brownstein's book, herbal smoking mixtures, which you know, you might know about, but a lot of people don't know about that book actually, because it's a tiny little thing but it is local to you and I think he feels a little embarrassed at times about this being a way that some people like get into his world.

Speaker 2: 13:07

But for me it was life changing. So I read that little booklet and I was like, oh my God, I can, I can smoke other herbs, like I don't have to only smoke tobacco. And then, after going on that plant walk, I had already been introduced to at least three of the herbs, like manzanita bark I mean, it's harsh but like manzanita bark, the raspberry leaf, blackberry leaf, like these things, that I knew that I could go outside mugwort, that I could go outside and I could harvest, I could dry and then I could put into my smoking blends. And so I immediately was just like I'm going to do that, I'm going to try. So I started making my own smoking blends and trying smoking all these different herbs and over the course of time I had tried to stop smoking tobacco for, probably like over the course of five years, probably like 10 times, like a significant amount of times, and this was the key for me.

Speaker 2: 14:00

So I actually started adding more and more herbs into my blends. And then I learned I could go into town and I could get some other herbs that actually I liked the taste of better Like I really liked Damiana actually in my blends the taste of better, like I really liked Damiana actually in my blends. So and I liked the way it felt too so so I would start adding like the Damiana and the raspberry leaf and I loved a little bit of mugwort in there and the tobacco. And over time I just took less and less tobacco, put less and less tobacco in and all of a sudden I was only smoking herbs. And so that was truly like for me, my first massive life change around herbal medicine and something that I don't think a lot of people think, oh, herbal medicine relates to smoking. But for me it was like wow, I no longer have this addiction.

Speaker 1: 14:49

I love that. That is so great, Especially like I hear a lot of people, a lot of my students, are like how do I quit smoking? What can I do? And yes, you can smoke many herbs, you know, and tobacco being an herb right, Not necessarily the one you want to be addicted to all of the time. But I think one of my great teachers is named. He's named Dr Glenn Nagel.

Speaker 2: 15:15

Have you ever met him or taken classes with him. I met him at the Brighton Bush Herbal Conference.

Speaker 1: 15:19

actually he's so much fun, right, and he's just brilliant. But he always says don't be an herbalitist. Because here in Oregon cannabis is very prevalent and when I owned my herbal apothecary I remember people saying like they'd come in and they'd be like, well, can I get cannabis here? And I'm like no, there's other herbs people. But I love that those herbs got you from smoking cigarettes and I love that I asked the question about like how'd you get into herbs? Because how many fabulous stories did you just share with us? Like from neem, like I think of neem and it's something I've used a lot in various gardens and used as an insect repellent, and I haven't really used neem internally, but it sounds like it did a really fabulous job for you.

Speaker 2: 16:11

Yeah, and so, yes, and so, so it's different. So the neem oil is what you're using. The neem seed oil is what you're using in your garden, right, and so that is actually the extracted oil from not infused, but an extracted oil from the seed. We've used that to in our organic gardens and I and you can use that internally. In fact, that's one of the yeah, it's disgusting smelling, but it's the leaf actually. So the leaf, this the it's it's a tree, so, like the branches and the docks and stuff, or the stem and even the bark, is really also medicinal, but it's the leaf that we were using. So it was just, I think, powdered leaf and I was taking it in capsules and that's actually extremely anti-malarial, anti-parasitic, anti-microbial in general. It's actually a pretty incredible and it's strong. It's not something I would want to be taking every day of my life forever, but the idea of having an ally when you're in a place that has tropical diseases, it's a nice addition, yeah.

Speaker 1: 17:11

That sounds amazing, like I love hearing that story and I love hearing that you're using the lead because, again, it's not something that I've I've worked a lot with, I know it, I've used it, but I haven't used it in those kinds of ways. So that's beautiful. And the other beautiful piece of the Tulsi and the women bringing you the Tulsi I have over the last couple of years have just like I don't know where I've been or what I was thinking, but I wasn't using Tulsi for so many years as an herbalist and the past few years I am like I am best friends with Tulsi. I have Tulsi in my cup right now and what a beautiful, beautiful plant. And I bet the amazing women bringing it to you like was it kind of ceremonial or how did it go when they brought it to you?

Speaker 2: 20:44

I wouldn't say it was ceremonial. I understand the idea around that, but really what was what it felt like was it was just tea time and it was typically women who were the farm. We were also farm workers, so they were just kind of going and making the tea and then bringing over a tray of it. But yeah, it was just an herb that they clearly had such a strong relationship with. Not that they thought about it in that way, but in southern India Tulsi is actually like outside of people's homes.

Speaker 2: 21:11

A lot of people have a Tulsi plant and they decorate it. They go to it and decorate it every morning. It's almost like a goddess for them. So they have this relationship with Tulsi and in that climate it's actually a perennial plant and so where I live it can't be a perennial plant, so maybe I just did an annual plant here, but there it becomes really woody and they just have these plants for years and years, since they have this relationship with the tulsi. So I actually think that there is like, even though they didn't come over ceremonially, I think there is a way that the relationship that they had with the tulsi is so much more than just tea yeah, I can't help but think that it must have been.

Speaker 2: 21:53

Oh, my God Holy basil right Exactly.

Speaker 2: 21:55

Yes, yeah, truly holy, like a goddess, yeah, and I think I mean for me now same. I mean I didn't probably for 10 years came back from India. I really liked Tulsi, but I didn't. Tulsi wasn't around me, so I wasn't, I wasn't growing it, I just wasn't. It wasn't growing it, I just wasn't. It wasn't a part of my life for a long time. And then, probably, it was probably about I don't know, 10, 12 years ago that I started growing the more temperate Tulsi that you can get around here, and since then it has been, I think, a daily, almost a daily part of my life.

Speaker 1: 22:30

Yeah, I love it, I get, I get mine doesn't. It doesn't thrive where I live because I live in a pretty wet, dark rainforest area, um, but I've been getting mine through Oshala herb farm and that makes me so happy. I just really really love it. I feel like that's something that when I'm like teaching my students and things, I'm like, well, we could talk about Tulsi for the next five months or more and all of its amazing benefits. So, yeah, I'm just really in love with that plant so much lately.

Speaker 1: 23:04

And I want to like talk about that fascination when you start to walk around and recognize that the plants in the forest are actually your friends and that they are medicine. Like I know exactly where you were and I the name of the place that you were doing your sustainability and farm work I in Cottage Grove. You just said it. I've heard of it. Yeah, yeah, yeah, say it again Apervato. Yes, yes, yes, thank you, um, I definitely looked into that way back, probably around the same time that you were there. I was living down in Eugene around that time, so we have crossed paths so many times.

Speaker 2: 23:46

That was in 2005. So I don't know when if that was when you were there but I was in Eugene. I was in and out of Eugene from 2005 and 2006. That was my world. So actually I was in, I was in and out of Eugene from 2005 and 2006.

Speaker 1: 23:56

That was my world. So actually I was in, I was in Portland by then, but still my family has been down in Eugene the whole time and yeah, anyways, um, but yeah, that like amazing feeling when you're like there's so much more and it's so wild, like now you and I can probably think about like how crazy it is that we didn't really discover that or make that connection. And it was my 20s for me, yeah, and so many people don't have that knowledge and wisdom early on in life. What a freaking shame. What a shame, but also what a mind blowing experience to step into and to be like oh it's, it just opens up a whole new world and I'm curious how he's amazing and a hilarious teacher.

Speaker 1: 24:49

I wanted to go to his school, Columbine's I forget how he titles the end of it, but botanical or herbal studies, columbine Botanical studies or something. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I always wanted to go, but I couldn't like get away from where I was living in my life to go, dedicate the time to go down with him. So I did get to do a lot of field work through Elderberry School of Botanical Medicine and with Scott Close and a few other great herbalists up here, but did you get to go learn with Howie while you were down there?

Speaker 2: 25:20

No, and I did not, I was. I read the.

Speaker 1: 25:24

I read the booklet, so that's learning with them.

Speaker 2: 25:27

I did read the booklet, I started working with the herbs. It changed my life. I was at APRO for probably that's how I say APRO for probably five or six months, and then I knew that I wanted to learn more about herbs, but I actually had no money. Like I said, I had no money, so the idea of going to school was not an option for me, like I didn't have funding to do so. So I was like, how do I learn about this?

Speaker 2: 25:52

And so I was looking through the woof catalog you know the worldwide workers on organic farms and work, training, work, training and I found an herbalist in North Carolina, no less. This is not anywhere close. I don't have a car, I don't money. How am I gonna get North Carolina? But he's in North Carolina and he says you know, you can come and you can live here and be an apprentice. And I'm like that's pretty neat. So I I wrote him a letter this is 2005 in the mail to this dude who I have read his little, like I don't know paragraph introduction on on this little page send him this letter, tell him I'm interested. He writes back, I get the letter and he says, yeah, you're welcome to come. And I'm like okay, cool, so that's my next step. So I was 22 or 23 at the time. Of course, I'm just like this kind of wild thing and really very oriented to just I'm gonna hop out, go. No, I'm gonna go, I'm gonna find I got a dream.

Speaker 1: 26:47

I'm gonna do it, totally yeah, I think going to hop out, I'm going to go.

Speaker 2: 26:48

I'm going to find I got a dream. I'm going to do it Totally. Yeah, I think I even just like random and I didn't. I don't, I didn't hitchhike at the time in the way of like putting my thumb out, but I did a lot of like finding rides places, oh yeah, so I likely I don't totally remember, but I likely like found rides across the country ended up eventually in North Carolina and I moved in. I love it to Joe Hollis it's. This is Joe Hollis of Mountain Gardens Herbs, who's no? He just passed last year.

Speaker 2: 27:17

Yeah um, there's actually yeah, there's actually a documentary that is just coming out right now about him and he is just well. He was a wild human. There's a lot of things that were. There was a very mixed bag in moving in with him and having this experience of living on off-grid, on land at the end of a dirt road with no car and no money, with this man who also didn't have much money and you know a life that we were living together. Essentially he's also kind of a hermit. He was older.

Speaker 2: 27:47

There's a lot of things that in my early twenties it wasn't like the perfect match, but he was an elder herbalist that at the time an elder and that was 20 years ago and he just passed last year. So I think he passed in his eighties. He was probably in his sixties but me in my early twenties he seemed pretty old to me, so he was like my grandparents age. So it was like a very a feeling of being with this, this elder. I didn't mean to like, I just saw this. It was like really just this opportunity to go someplace. I didn't have to pay money and learn about herbs, but I got there and I moved into my little cabin and I think probably the next day he was pressing out a tincture and he was like this with a tincture press, and he's just like teaching me how to do that. And then we're making infused oils and he's teaching me how to make a salve, and then he's asking me to just weigh out herbs for the local acupuncturist to fill orders, and so I'm just doing that, and then there's tons of books and there's all these Chinese herbs and jars and then we're like separating I jars, and then we're like separating I don't. I didn't know anything, I didn't know what to ask, but I was just doing all these things that he was just suggesting to do.

Speaker 2: 28:54

He wasn't a very talkative person, except when he's teaching a class. So he's the kind of guy who walks around silently and you kind of have to ask him if you're curious about learning. Otherwise he's just like this is go to cola, we're going to separate the plant, you know that sort of thing. And then like, okay, cool, he's like this is how you do it, just pulling the roots apart. So I'm just, I'm just learning through being and through doing with him, which I kept I was.

Speaker 2: 29:18

It was incredible actually, now that I look back at that, I had no idea what a gift that time was or what a gift that experience was. I was only there for a couple of months, but in my early twenties that's a pretty significant chunk of like full on living in this space and just learning from someone you know. We were going out, he was teaching me. He also didn't have money, so he was like suggesting that I just go eat wild food from the land. So I had to go find wild weeds and learn how to cook them and not, you know, have diarrhea and stuff. So I had a lot find wild weeds and learn how to cook them and not, you know, have diarrhea and stuff. So I had a lot of learning to do.

Speaker 1: 29:53

I love it and you're writing back home to mom and dad. So today I'm learning about this crazy weed in North Carolina and how I could use it as food. Aren't you glad I went through college? It's so real.

Speaker 2: 30:12

It's a hundred percent real. Yeah, because truly it was writing, because we were totally off grid at the time and yeah, it was just a very different reality. So, um, such an interesting experience. I even, you know, to bathe. It was either bathing in his greenhouse in this tub that he would fill up occasionally, or it was going to the spring, to the river, you know, and just bathing in the river and it was, it was cold. I went in March, so March to May or so, so it was like there was still snow on the ground, like going to this little river and washing myself off. So it's an interesting experience.

Speaker 2: 30:42

But part of what he did as well was he really tended then the wild plants in his landscape too. So he introduced me to blood root, he introduced me to ramps, he introduced me to a bunch of different like the cohoches and just like a bunch of different plants, trilliums that were out there, that he actually would go and tend to those communities, so like he really would go back to the same communities. He just lived at the base of mount mitchell so you could go up, there were trails and stuff, and he'd go to these certain communities that he would just like pay attention to and see what was happening and gather the seeds and reseed and it was just, he was just a very I don't know. There's nobody that I've encountered that's quite like him. And I hadn't, because this was my entire introduction to what an herbalist was. I had no concept that this was like something different from what other people were. So that was, honestly, when I think about, like you're like, did I go to study with Howie? No, I didn't.

Speaker 1: 31:41

I went and I and next step up not to discredit Howie and his brilliance, you know but wow, but then I had to leave. I was supposed to be that. I have to be really honest.

Speaker 2: 31:48

I was supposed Not to discredit Howie and his brilliance, you know, but wow, but then I had to leave. I was supposed to be I have to be really honest I was supposed to be there for the entire season and I was there for two, two, not two years for two months and I was just in my young twenties, at the end of a dirt road with this man who was basically like a hermit and I. It wasn't the right match for me. Yeah, so I actually left and and it took me a couple of couple of few years from that to actually start diving more into herbal medicine in a way where it was like going to an apprenticeship program and actually doing that. So, yeah, but that was the beginning for me for sure.

Speaker 1: 32:25

That's so cool. I don't know much about Joe, but I do remember his passing. I like reading a lot of great stories of him. But, gosh, that story you just shared there is fabulous, and the whole like oh, I'm in my 20s and I want to do something, so I'm going to go do it. I mean, it sounds like we lived very similar lives. I was very much that kind of all right, this sounds exciting. Next, let's go do it.

Speaker 1: 32:52

Some days I miss that freedom. That freedom is now gone as a mother and all of the other things that have happened in life as we grow. Gosh, yeah, what an incredible experience and it's so valuable to be able to have those experiences. And you're right, you know, sure it was two months or so for you in your 20s, but like, those two months are so incredibly impactful, right, like just beautiful. And then, like now I know you and I both went through, or you completely went through, dr Aviva Ram's herbal medicine for women's health, and you are quite an amazing practitioner.

Speaker 1: 33:36

You are a teacher, you are a podcast host, you are a person working one on one with people teaching in your community, teaching online, and I want to hear a little bit like how that's all gone for you. Because when I hear your story and I hear you say like I had no idea, you know, didn't know how special that was, I can think back to my early herbal influences and things that like, like the plants, that kind of grab you Right, and you have no idea. I say this to people often like if I would have known back in like 1999, when I started being like, oh my gosh, these plants, they're here, they're medicine. And this is really cool because I was a backpacking guy, that's how I got into it. I was like pay me to be outside, that's all I want to do.

Speaker 1: 34:22

Yeah, if anybody would have ever told me that I'd be still infatuated with this world of herbal medicine enough to like my job is to talk about it every single day I would have never known that back then, right, yeah. So I just want to hear a little bit more about your journey. As you continued down the path, like you started learning more. I know you've done Julia Blankenspores, julia Blankenspores, chestnut School of Herbal Medicine. I know you learned with Dr Aviva. I know you are also an education addict. So, yeah, I want to hear a little more.

Speaker 2: 35:06

It's a good description. So actually actually after Joe, I wanted to learn more about herbal medicine, but I wasn't clear on how to do that and I ended up in New Mexico and I ended up in bodywork school. So that was my next step was but it was a bodywork school where they also taught herbalism and I honestly look back at that. I'm like I learned almost nothing in that herbalism class, even though it was just so. I'm like I learned almost nothing in that herbalism class, even though it was just so much. Looking at a book and it was actually a good book Like I look back at that now is the I think it's called the heart of herbs by Cheryl Tilden. Like it's not, it's a good book. It's just that if you're new to herbs and you're more of an embodied person, to just learn out of a book is really hard.

Speaker 1: 35:44

So that's a hard. It's a great book. I have it also, and she lives down in Pleasant Hill, um, near cottage Grove, um, but I can see where that would be a really challenging book if that was like your program.

Speaker 2: 35:59

Yeah, it's also not like an introduction to herbal, not like an appropriate introduction to herbalism book, but anyway, all that said went to this body work school was really inspired to do like basically body work, integrative, healing forms of work, kind of bring the herbs in as I could, and towards the end of my program I actually we were learning some subtle work that's similar to craniosacral, a little different, something called core synchronism, and we did that with pregnant people, with mamas and pregnant people. And as I was and I had been working I mean I'd done over 100, maybe 150 hours or something of clinics I'd worked with a lot of people at that point and as I was working on this pregnant mama, I noticed this subtle energy that I was just like, wow, this is special, like something about like that connection, the energy that was present with little babe inside was so different and I was just like I want to work more with this energy. I want to work more with these people. So I was like, what do I do next? So I literally was like I want to work with birth. I was introduced to a home birth midwife and I was just like, oh, home birth, midwifery, that is definitely a path for me. So I initially I immediately started looking into what do I do to start doing that. Of course I still don't have very much money, so I'm like, okay, apprenticeship, whatever all these different options.

Speaker 2: 37:21

But in order to even start, people kept saying, oh, it's a good idea to become a doula first. So I went and I became a doula birth doula and a postpartum doula and I started attending births and I was doing these like really community led kind of apprenticeship midwifery, home birth midwifery, a couple different ones with different midwives. So I was learning some skills and some information. But it was all so much like I think maybe you can relate to this but for me I did not have a biology or science background. I did not do that in college. I was like social sciences, like learned about culture and religion and stuff, and so it was just so different for me and it went over my head so much like all the hormones and like all the connections and all this stuff. I was just like I had to learn it like four times in order to actually start to get it. But I learned it with different people, you know. But I was focusing on that and really focused on the midwifery and in the course of that, so many home birth midwives work with herbs like they do because that's what they have access to. So I was just learning the herbs in relation to the perinatal period and I was just becoming really familiar with that. And I was working with some massage clients and I was just like handing them things that I had heard about that might be good for them Some nettles here, some al, some, you know, alfalfa they're like just nourishing herbs, some things that might be helpful and some of them came back and really got it actually felt really good. And so then, as I was learning, you know, just about midwifery, I realized that I wanted to learn more about the herb. I wanted to get better at the herbs. So I sought out an apprenticeship.

Speaker 2: 38:44

This was in 2008. It's not like that long after, but it was enough time that I feel like I took a little moment of a break in my twenties. That felt like a while, but I guess that was in 2008. And I started. I went to Bleeding Star Herbal School with Tony Lemos. This is in Western Massachusetts, so at the time I had moved to Western Massachusetts and it's a real hotbed for herbal medicine, home birth, midwifery, doula work, all the kind of integrative health stuff. It's a really interesting area and while I was there, so I started this program and it was actually an apprenticeship program that was really low cost, which was awesome, and we went every Tuesday. I think it was like every Tuesday from 10 to four for a year. We were going to her home and working in the garden and seeding the plants and making medicines and learning about bioregional herbalism. We were just like learning about the plants from being with the plants.

Speaker 2: 39:40

And she actually was trained she's I think she's from the UK originally. She was trained in like more in the UK they do more like science based, like university based herbalism. So she initially started there and then she came to the US and she actually studied with Susan Weed. So, like Susan Weed was a big part of her kind of bridging the worlds and making it into. I know she's a controversial figure so I'll just speak that into the space without ignoring it, but she's a pivotal part of what herbal medicine is in the united states today too.

Speaker 2: 40:11

And so, anyway, tony was really inspired by all this kind of like embodied relationship to the plants and she brought that into what she had already learned and so there was actually she had taken over the school I'm not going to remember the name, it was a different herbalist school that Tony had taken over and so started in. This apprenticeship program was something that had gone back to probably starting in like the 80s or something, and so Tony had taken that on and I think I was one of the first years of her her teaching this. But anyway, I didn't know that at the time, but she was really an embodied, and so I learned about the plant seasonal herbalism. That's what I was learning, and then I was also bringing that into my work with my birth clients, so, and my massage clients. So that was really cool. So I did that for a while.

Speaker 2: 40:56

And then then, because I was in the birth world, I heard about Aviva. So that is how I initially found Aviva Ram, I think, probably in like. I probably started hearing about her in like 2009, 2010 or something, but that was before. She was nobody, yeah, anyway, she was still in medical school. It was a different, different, um, she had a different presence actually back then. So, anyway, I was drawn into her world and I was just like this is someone I want to learn with, and so I found my way to actually like. I just remember I did not have like easy access to finances, so it was just a real like how am I going to make this happen? And then like saving the money and then choosing to do it, and I even paid like probably I don't know a third of what it is now like for that program. But I really wanted to learn it because it was so very much in my world. So I started that program in like 2010 or 2011 or something like that. I think you might've started at a similar time.

Speaker 1: 41:51

I think it was like 2012 for me, maybe, maybe 11, somewhere in that circle.

Speaker 2: 41:57

Yeah and and. But then, as I think we've talked about before and probably anyone who's listening who has any awareness of that program, it it is actually quite a comprehensive, very like medical terminology, like really like deeply diving into all the different parts of being with a womb, like the process of life, and it was not an easy one for me to move through, like I think I, I, it took me, oh gosh, I think 10 years to get through that program, because it's also all on your own Right. So that was the other piece that I think a lot of people can relate to. It's such a dense program and then there's no action or there wasn't actually any kind of like support along the way. So it was just like you're on your own now.

Speaker 2: 42:44

Yeah, um, so that was. That was a rough go for me, but I eventually I kept coming back to it because, like this I was like this is the core of what I'm wanting to do and offer in the world, what I already am working on. So I just need to continue through so very slowly, like a little, you know, like a little snail, like found my way, yeah.

Speaker 1: 43:04

And then I love that you did though like I still have not officially completed that and I've used that program and all the resources basically as reference material for a long time like I need to learn about this right now and let me go learn about it. But we're not alone on how long that takes. Like many of my fellow students in the beginnings of my other herbal programs are still working on it. Quite a few of my friends who are naturopaths and who are midwives are like do you want to get a study group together? Even said this like I don't know how many times over the last decade where we're like I really want to do it and we like get this excited study group for like a month and then we're all like.

Speaker 2: 43:50

I have been a part of those study groups. Yes, with midwives and naturopaths, and, it's funny, I worked at an herb shop when I was in California and a bunch of the people at the herb shop were in the program. We got together Like they're herbalists practicing. Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1: 44:10

Anyway, I think now, though, that she's like putting a little more time and effort into the community and they're doing more live stuff at least I'm getting the emails for it. So, yeah, it's really important to have community when learning, or mentors, or I mean, there's a lot you can do on your own right, and it sounds like you got really crafty and creative, and I think, when we are limited on resources, that's what we have the option to do. And plus, back then in that learning journey, like online learning was nowhere near as prevalent I mean, the online world was hardly as prevalent Truly makes me feel like we're old, but we don't look old.

Speaker 2: 44:47

I know, I just think, I think about that stuff. I'm like, yeah, and I mean, when I was with Tony, there was no online. There was no online anything. It wasn't an option. And it was with Aviva when I joined. It wasn't an online program, it was like a you get the books, yeah.

Speaker 1: 45:03

Yes, these ones. Oh, not that that one. They look like that, though. That's what? No, not that one either. That's a brighton bush one, so I keep all my older books, um, anyways.

Speaker 2: 45:16

Oh, hers are on the other end of my bookcase, but totally get it, though mine are way, way back there. I haven't yeah. Yeah, I mean it, it was. It was correspondence, essentially a correspondence. So anyway, it is obviously we're dating ourselves wise.

Speaker 1: 45:31

We are now the wise, we are becoming the wise women, right like is that what's? Is that's what? Is that what we are now?

Speaker 2: 45:37

I don't know if we can claim that, but we're getting there closer we're heading steps closer yeah, absolutely. I love that. Yeah, yeah. So I was sitting with her and I mean, I was going through midwifery school at the same time. I did so many things while I was still in that program. So, and like many, many, many, many other people do that too.

Speaker 1: 45:55

I was doing my clinical herbal studies during that time and I'm like I don't really need to pay attention to that right now, because I'm in person, learning, doing all of the things.

Speaker 2: 46:05

Yeah, so I think I. I think after that I actually joined Seja Popham's first astro herbalism course. That was when, I mean, and most people didn't know who he was. He wasn't really a thing back then. So I just think of this and I'm like, how did I even find out about these things? But I was really interested in that and it just became kind of like a hobby of mine. I was curious about that whole world and that's about all I studied with him. But I thought it was really interesting and then I did do. I did like I just started getting voraciously interested in like how can I really deepen my practice?

Speaker 2: 46:36

I started working at the herb shop in California and then I realized I really wanted to work more clinically. So I'm like working at the herb shop basically as a community herbalist, right, so I'm there. It used to be called Halo. It's Remedy Garden now, if anybody's in the Nevada City area in California. But Jaway, who owns it now, was a fellow, a fellow herbalist at the behind the counter with me, which is just I love thinking about that.

Speaker 2: 46:58

But, um, when I was doing that, it was like I was answering questions all the time, like constant, and I just started to realize I mean, I was already seeing people like, like I said, you know my massage clients or. But I realized I wanted to go deeper into the clinical parts, right, like I wanted to dive into really understanding body systems and what. How can I do that? And I remember somebody coming into the herb shop. This is actually a part of the story. She comes into the herb shop and she's from New York city I can tell she's not from there and she's from New York city and she's talking about her clinical practice and how she's like financially sustaining herself with a clinical herbal practice. And I'm just like in New York city like, tell me more, tell me more.

Speaker 2: 47:40

Turns out she was also a body worker, but anyway, regardless, she's doing both and um, and I was like, well, where'd you go to school? And she was like, oh, I went to Thai Sophia, right? So like it was like this master's program, thai Sophia. I heard her say that and I was like, okay, cool, whatever Interesting it's in Maryland, it has no relationship to me. I'm definitely not moving to Maryland. I wasn't that interested.

Speaker 2: 48:00

But then I went to Santa Fe and I was talking to my friend who was a pediatrician. She is still a pediatrician. She's a really close friend of mine and she's like I know that you are a brilliant human and I trust you, but I would not be able to like send a patient of mine or like refer a patient of mine to somebody who doesn't have the highest degree in their field. And I know nothing about herbal medicine and I just can't, I'm not going to go learn it, so I really would need somebody to have the highest degree in their field. That like rang in my head and I was like, oh, my gosh, that that woman that I just met, who's the clinical herbalist, who's like supporting herself in New York city, went and got a master's degree. There's like no master's degrees that are herbal medicine except this one. So I actually looked into it. I think two or three months later I had enrolled in that program and it was Maryland University of Integrative Health at the time so it had turned and it'd become online. So it's just like 2017 or something. So they actually shifted it from being an in-person or a hybrid program and it was still a hybrid program when I was there, but it was just. You had a couple of intensives to go to. Mostly it was online. So I ended up doing that.

Speaker 2: 49:11

I got my master's of science degree in clinical herbal medicine. It was a three year, really intensive, three trimesters a year, like no break type of experience, doing a lot of very academic herbal study and also learned clinical clinical work. But I was already doing. It's interesting because I was kind of already doing a lot of it. I wouldn't even say, anyway, it's a. It's a. Yes, there are many programs out there, yes, that teach clinical.

Speaker 2: 49:46

I do think. I think it's really important to get a lot of practice. I learned a lot of the didactics, a lot of the physiology, pathophysiology I'm so grateful. I learned how to analyze research studies. I learned about how much. Actually, a lot of people say that a lot of herbs are not studied. There is so much research out there, actually actually herbal medicine like, especially in other countries, so I actually found that really interesting and that has really it's. It's invigorated me in a lot of ways to be like, oh, I kind of have evidence here, like this is just like something I'm I'm doing because I heard about it, or it's not just traditional knowledge like so many people talk about, and now I can talk doctor, like I actually can have a conversation with my friend who's a pediatrician and I can speak her language Right, and that's something that is invaluable.

Speaker 2: 50:36

I am grateful that I did that program for that reason.

Speaker 1: 50:39

Yeah, absolutely yeah, there's. It's a big difference between the book study and the sit there go through the program, do the thing versus like actually getting out there and doing the thing right, like talking to people, learning different clinical assessment skills, learning how one herb might impact the body and that particular unique body. Right, it's. It's really deep and there's a lot to be said on that credibility piece. I don't have my master's.

Speaker 1: 51:13

I went through a clinical program and have done the things you know, um, but I think a lot of what initiated my desire to go through the clinical program that I went through was so that I wouldn't just be that woo, woo, hippy, dippy person, that people could take me seriously, that I could speak science to people that need to hear it. And it also makes me think back to Aviva and like her whole journey right, 30 year midwife and herbalist has been doing the thing, but nobody's listening to her because she's just an herbalist. So what she do, she goes to Yale and becomes a medical doctor, right, and now look at her, look at who's listening. Now you know.

Speaker 2: 52:03

It's pretty amazing. It's pretty amazing and interesting and I think that there is a part of that that is it's a real. You know, it's pretty amazing. It's pretty amazing and interesting and I think that there is a part of that that is it's a real. I don't know that that's not the world that I, if I envision a world that we live in. That is not like the world that I'm envisioning, that you have to get these higher degrees in order to be right. But I do know that it matters. I know that there are people who've trusted me more because I have a master's of science degree.

Speaker 1: 52:24

It definitely matters to some. It doesn't matter to everybody. But yes, depends on where you want to go with it. Right, that clinical practice probably pretty valuable. One of my students went to the Maryland school as well, and I think the other option is Bastyr, to the best of my knowledge. I don't know if they have a master's.

Speaker 2: 52:42

They don't have a master's, they have a bachelor's.

Speaker 1: 52:43

But yeah, people do the bachelor's of science degree and, um, yeah, best year in herbal science, yeah, but but then there's also the magic of the traditional knowledge.

Speaker 2: 52:55

Oh my gosh and it's huge and I I would never want to only have that academic, like master, masters of science degree. I actually don't. Yeah, that's just on it. It's so separated from the embodied practice and I don't mean just embodied clinical. I think a person can be a great clinician and actually know what they learned in that program and move through, move through kind of the path of working with the dispensary and having other people make the medicines and then you just fill them like you can be a great clinician in that way if you are actually orienting yourself in that path. But in terms of being like, what feeds me as an herbalist is very much the embodied relationship with the plants and my embodied relationship with practice.

Speaker 2: 53:41

I am not I know that you've been a product maker that sold products before. I've never done. I've. I've always made products. I make my own, like seasonal products. I do it every single year, all the time. I'll always make my own stuff. You know I'm like I make stuff all the time but I don't make it for sale. That's just not hasn't been my path as an herbalist. I've certainly made things that I've offered to clients, but it's not a in the store type of thing. Yeah, yeah, there's just so many different. There's just so many different ways.

Speaker 1: 54:12

Yeah, I think that's the beauty of it, as how many different paths you can travel with it and it sounds like you have done many. I definitely have done money, and I think that everyone I've learned from has done many different iterations of it and you just kind of I don't know. You walk the path and you make the turns when they tell you, when the plants tell you to make the turn. I think it's kind of how it happens.

Speaker 2: 54:35

Yeah, and I think that's something that I don't know. I probably I started learning really early on because I started having different teachers and I imagine you felt this too Probably like like I don't know. When I started going to conferences. I would I, which are great, I think conferences are amazing place to kind of get exposure and learn from different people and just see where you resonate and what direction you want to go in. But when I started going to conferences I was like wow, they're teaching something entirely different from what I learned from Tony or from someone else. And then I'm like wow, herbal medicine, this is like it's not this streamlined. This is the way path.

Speaker 2: 55:15

It's very, very eclectic, very diverse. Like Matthew Wood is doing drop doses with people, david Winston is like hell. No, matthew Wood is doing drop doses with people, david Winston is like hell. No, I am not doing drop doses, I'm doing therapeutic doses. You know, it's like it's so interesting to literally hear like these are two what I just named. You know, I named two men, but like I named Matthew Wood and David Winston and they are both practicing herbalists who've been practicing for decades. They both have clinical experience and they practice entirely differently, entirely differently, absolutely. When you start learning that it's like wait, I'm totally confused. And then it's like I think that's a lot of times for people, including myself, when I'm like I need to learn so much more so I can find my own way in this, because it's not just this way and that's the way it's like actually, no, I have to kind of gather from various sources, various places, and then find what feels true and right for me.

Speaker 1: 56:14

Absolutely. I think that's the I mean, that's that's the beauty and the passion of it for me is that this is never ending learning. This is a life journey. Is that this is never ending learning? This is a life journey? I am always going to find another teacher, another plant, another person, another scenario where I am mind blown and suddenly inspired to be like, okay, now I want to learn about that and now I need to know this and I? That, to me, is the beauty of it. I was a kid in school who got bored very easily, and I don't get bored with herbal medicine.

Speaker 2: 56:53

No, it's it is truly endless. It's it's light times, I believe, of learning. I think I think it's David Winston. David Winston has become another teacher of mine, so I started studying with him again. This is after I went to grad school. I joined his two-year program and now I'm in his third year program, cause I was just like he's going to retire at some point and I just really. He is one of the foremost clinicians of our time. Like the amount he's such an encyclopedia too. It's brilliant. I need to get in this program so much clinical experience billions.

Speaker 2: 57:21

So much clinical experience. Just it's. It's incredible to be learning from him and some of the people who teach in his school too. I didn't know, but I really appreciate too now. But what was I going to say about that? Oh, one of the things that he says is that if you ever stop learning I mean and he's been, I think he's been a practicing herbalist since the early seventies If you ever stop learning, if you ever think you know everything in herbal medicine, you are wrong. Like, yeah, not, that is not, it's not the truth. Like it's just, it's a consistent.

Speaker 2: 57:56

And the more people that we expose ourselves to, like whether they're in your program learning community herbalism, they're in my program learning natural contraception or other different, or they're learning about uterine tonics or menstrual health or whatever the heck it is that's happening. Or they're going to learn with Seija who I am going to name because he is one of my teachers but learning astro herbalism or vitalist practice, whatever he's teaching you know these kinds of things. There's so many paths, you know, and I think we gather gems from every single place. Like it's not most of us, I think. If there's an herbalist who's some kind of carbon copy of another herbalist, they're probably not, probably not an American herbalist and they're probably and they're probably not actually practicing from the deep place. That is like really like their own embodied path.

Speaker 1: 58:42

So they're authentic herbalist self. I love that. I want to say one thing on that, what David Winston was saying one of my favorite teachers through my journey has been Paul Bergner and he's also been practicing for 40, 50 years. And when I was learning from and with him, I remember him saying you know, I've been doing this for 40 years. And when I was learning from and with him, I remember him saying you know, I've been doing this for 40 years and I figure I've got like at least another 90 to 150 to go before I'm a master herbalist and I'm like all right, and it was great that he shared that and it stuck.

Speaker 1: 59:22

It stuck with me for so long, to the point that oftentimes it gave me this feeling of imposter syndrome of like who am I to teach? I don't know anything. Oh wait, I do know more than some people and I can help those people and then they can find the rest of their journey and their path. So yeah, there's there's so much to learn and it's so beautiful. And I want to go back to what you're doing now today. Like, obviously your story has been amazing and I know you really specialize in women's health. So tell me what you're doing today with all these incredible teachers you've had.

Speaker 2: 1:00:02

Yeah, well, I'm bridging all the worlds that I've walked, like all the worlds that I've walked through, right. So I studied, I started certainly with the plants and then ended up with the womb and then over time, have developed that knowledge, right, and I'm so grateful for all of that and I now weave it all together. So, yeah, I mean I am, I've got my podcast, herbal Womb Wisdom, so I'm covering all things womb, herbs and honestly, just deep wisdom, earth wisdom, seasonal lifestyle, like really have amazing guests come on there who just share about all kinds of things. I love weaving people in who are walking paths where they're kind of like at the edge of their field or they're stepping into like an insight or a new knowledge or they can bring a way of seeing and being in the world. Honestly, what I'm up to is helping us to connect more deeply with our womb spaces, with our bodies, with the wisdom inside us, and also connect with the wisdom, the seasonal wisdom, the seasons and cycles inside and outside of us. So that's kind of what I'm doing.

Speaker 2: 1:01:02

So I've got my podcast doing that. I'm teaching classes. I do sometimes take new clients. I'm not currently taking new clients, but I do sometimes take new clients to do one-on-one work. Yeah, I just love. I love sharing and exploring what is possible for us in the world. So one of the things that I'm doing right now, that I'm like actually actively doing right now, is offering natural contraception online, which is a program. It's actually a program. It's pretty awesome program.

Speaker 1: 1:01:31

Yeah, of course it is. Look at that.

Speaker 2: 1:01:34

But it's really it's. It's combining what I've been doing. I've been practicing fertility awareness style fertility awareness method style natural contraception for since 2008. So I don't know maybe 17 years now at this point and I learned that when I was in midwifery school, because I learned it when I was learning how to help people to conceive. And then I was like, oh my gosh, I can use this as a birth control, cool. So I started doing it. I didn't realize it wasn't something that, like, a lot of other people were doing, because I was in my 20s at the time and more recently I realized that people were really interested in this, so I brought together.

Speaker 2: 1:02:07

Now I'm teaching fertility awareness to people who are new to it or who are just like they want to get into it. I have a student right now who said that for 10 years she's been starting to, she's been wanting to try tracking her cycle and she just hasn't done it. And so this is this beautiful space where we're creating like a little bit of accountability and container for people to take the steps, feel the confidence, learn their bodies. I love teaching embodied anatomy too, and physiology, so I help people to understand their cycles and their hormones from a place that's not just like super heady and separate. I feel like when I've learned the hormones, a lot of times it's felt like, oh, that's that thing on a paper, on a piece of paper. It's not in my body. So I really help people to bring it into their own body too, versus it just being something you're learning outside, and then I'm bringing the herbs in.

Speaker 2: 1:02:56

So I'm bringing in herbs to support us to prevent pregnancy within not talking herbal abortion, I'm talking about, like within our typical cycle time, what we can do to support preventing pregnancy. And it is pretty I don't know, it's just it's. It's a pretty awesome container that's happening right now and so I'm very excited about that. That is happening. I'll be offering another one, another session. I I'm pretty sure I'm gonna be offering it this summer. For sure I'll be offering it sometime this year. I'm pretty sure that the next session is gonna be this summer. So if people are interested in that, that is gonna be happening again.

Speaker 1: 1:03:28

That's amazing. So if they are interested in it, how are they going to make sure they're connected with you? And don't forget.

Speaker 2: 1:03:34

Good point. So a couple of things. I actually have a wait list. If people in jumping on the waitlist, herbalwombcom forward slash class and you can just jump on the waitlist and you will be the first to hear about it. If you're interested in starting to track your cycle, just getting to know that basic initial like what are the things you're going to be doing, you can even really get started right now. Herbalwombcom forward slash track your cycle is a free guide. It also has some resources on it which are really great too to go further. So if you're interested in actually, like you know, some podcast episodes or some books that you can grab to learn even more deeply, that's on there too. So yeah, I hope that that is helpful for people. It's a great place to get started.

Speaker 1: 1:04:27

Yeah, we will definitely link to that in the show broadcast for sure, because I think so many of my listeners they're 99.9% women so they're going to be very, very interested in this kind of topic. And then I think, before we hit record, you were talking about another cool class that you have coming up, I think in March. What do you got there?

Speaker 2: 1:04:40

That's like a one-off class that I'm teaching for the earth body school, which seems kind of like a neat little online school space that invited me to teach. I'm going to teach uterine tonic, herbal uterine tonics, so we'll talk about it's probably like a two-hour class and we'll probably talk about I don't know 10, 15 herbs that are really supportive for womb health. Overall. I'll probably talk about different. So when we talk about uterine tonics, it's both for nourishing the womb space, but it also could be for supporting the strength, supporting the health of the womb. So, depending on which herbs, they all kind of do something a little different. So, yeah, I'm excited about sharing that.

Speaker 1: 1:05:17

That sounds like a fabulous class, so I'm going to recommend that anybody that would also like to learn about uterine tonics definitely head over to her website. Again, it's going to be linked inside of the show notes, but I would get on her list so that you can be in the know when that class happens and when she opens up. What is the name of your course Like? How do you call it? I know you just talked about it.

Speaker 2: 1:05:47

Natural Contraception, the Herbal Way.

Speaker 1: 1:05:50

Perfect when that opens up sometime in 2025, you're going to want to know so and you'll be teaching inside of the Community Herbalist Program later this year, which is super exciting. I can't wait to sit in on that class. That's part of the joy of hosting a whole program with guest teachers, because I'm learning with you. It's so fun. So thank you so much. You are such a joy to chat with and hearing your story is so inspiring and beautiful and fun, and I love knowing that you're coming out to my neck of the woods in April and we're going to frolic through some beautiful, luscious green trails and yeah, that maybe Trillium maybe see Trillium.

Speaker 2: 1:06:38

You can get on the ground and say hello.

Speaker 1: 1:06:40

Yeah, I'm pretty sure it's up right around then, because that was great, because Portland's an hour east or west of me and all of my Portland herbalist friends will be like, yay, these plants are coming up. And I'm like, cool, I got like two weeks and those plants are going to come up for me. So they're like my, my little pre-calendar, my reminder, like get ready, your friends are about to show up, so good.

Speaker 2: 1:07:05

Totally, totally. Yeah, I think we might even have a similar season here and I'm in Maine, so it's like a pretty northern climate. And yeah, our trilliums, I think I start seeing them. I think it's in there, in maybe the first week of May, that I typically start seeing them.

Speaker 1: 1:07:20

So it's sunny right now today and I'm so excited for the plant friends to start popping up and I know I'm still only in january but the sun is returning the sun.

Speaker 2: 1:07:32

Yes, I'm so ready.

Speaker 1: 1:07:36

Okay, this has been amazing. I could chat with you for for decades. I love talking with you every single time that I get to, so I do want to respect your time, though, and I am so grateful to have you on the show. I can't wait to share it with everybody.

Speaker 2: 1:07:52

Yeah, thank you so much. Yeah, thank you Bye.

Speaker 1: 1:08:02

Thank you so much for tuning into another episode of the Herbalist Path. Being on this journey with you is absolutely incredible. If you dig this episode, please leave me a review on your favorite podcast player and share it with your friends so that together, we can make herbalism Hashtag spread like wildflowers. Herbalism hashtag spread like wildflowers. On another note, I must mention that, while I know you're getting some good info here, it's important to remember that this podcast is purely for entertainment and educational purposes and is not intended to be a substitute for medical treatment. While the information in this podcast is absolutely relevant, herbs work differently for each person and each condition. That's why I recommend you work with a qualified practitioner, whether that be another herbalist, a naturopath or your doctor. So thank you again. I am truly honored that you're tuning into these episodes and on the path with me to make sure that there's an herbalist in every home. Again, don't forget to share this episode with your friends so that we can make herbalism Hashtag spread like wildflowers.