Staying Regulated in a Dysregulated World: Nervous System Herbs for Challenging Times

The world feels heavy right now. Many of us are moving through stress, grief, anger, and exhaustion while trying to stay grounded in our lives and communities.

In this co-hosted episode of The Herbalist’s Path, Mel and Brittany talk honestly about what it looks like to stay regulated during hard times. They explore nervous system support through herbs, foundational practices, and self-awareness — without bypassing what’s happening in the world.

In this episode, we cover:

• Navigating stress & overwhelm
• Why this stress isn’t new for BIPOC communities & why context matters
• Nervines for immediate nervous system support
• Heart-centered herbs for grief 
• Milky oats for depleted nervous systems
• Adaptogens for long-term resilience & when to use them
• Foundational practices no tincture can replace
• Herbalist burnout and practicing what you preach
• Joy, laughter, and community care — including caring for yourself

This grounded conversation between two clinical herbalists focuses on resilience, capacity, and caring for yourself so you can keep showing up with integrity and clarity.

For full show notes, click HERE:

Ready to deepen your herbal practice?
Learn more about the Community Herbalist Certification and Mentorship Pro

Wondering how you can use your herbal skills to help people when times are tough?

Grab Medicine For The People - An Herbalist's Guide To Showing Up For Your Community In Times of Need

It's loaded with ideas and resources to help you help others!💚 Click here to ge

We're seeing more home herbalists pop up in the world today, and it's so beautiful to see!

That also truly skilled and knowledgeable herbalists that can go beyond surface level herbalists, and guide others on their healing journey. 

If you're feeling that call, I invite you to check out the Community Herbalist Certification & Mentorship here. 

Transcript

Welcome And Show Update

SPEAKER_00 0:06

Welcome to the Herbalist Path. If you love learning about the power of plant medicine and how to use it in your life, this show is for you. I'm Mel Mutterspa, clinical herbalist, herbal educator, and your host. In each episode, you're gonna hear me sharing herbal insights and knowledge from my 25 plus years of working with and learning from the plants. Plus, I'm gonna share interviews with some of the most amazing herbalists, educators, farmers, and healers out there, all bringing their herbal wisdom here for you. Really, this show is all about continuing this movement to put an herbalist in every home and a healer in every community. Again, thank you so much for listening and welcome to the herbalist path. Enjoy the show. Hello, hello, and welcome back to another episode on the herbalist path. We are in the midst of so much change in this world and change here on the herbalist path as I'm bringing Britney Williams into this whole big picture, kind of making it more of a collaborative effort on this herbal education journey, because we know that the more herbalists you have around to learn from, the better off you are going to be in your herbal journey. Like what a gift to learn from so many different heritages, so many different ways of practicing herbalism, and so on and so forth. So moving forward on this Herbalist Path podcast, you will be blessed with this amazing voice and smile of Brittany Williams from Eudaimonia Herbs. Some of the episodes she'll be here with me. Sometimes I'm gonna be interviewing somebody else, and sometimes it's just gonna be me again. So, anyways, Brittany, you're officially like, I don't know, co-host of the herbalism.

SPEAKER_01 2:11

Hello, and it did come out on audio. It didn't herbal hello. Love it, love it, love it.

Context: Exhaustion, Injustice, And Grief

SPEAKER_00 2:19

So, yeah, here we are. It is January 27th, 2026, as we are recording this episode right now. And before we got on, we were chatting about some of the life happenings and the world happenings today. And um, I'm feeling a bit exhausted, a bit tired. I have expended a lot of energy and feelings around what is happening currently in the United States and around the world. And I see many, many people also expending this energy and these feelings. And as an herbalist, I'm like, okay, well, I know I need to turn to herbs, of course, to support me and my nervous system. I know I really need to step outside, is the biggest thing for me. And, you know, there's there's so many different directions that this conversation could go as we move forward. Um, but I just wanted to kind of set the stage with where we are at right now in the time of the world right now. For me, I have deeply been feeling all of this energetic shift and change, both personally and within the world. I can sit in the doom and gloom kind of aspects of things, but I also can be quite the optimist and have this feeling that what is currently happening, so many people being so angry and enraged and sad and scared and all of these big, big, big emotions, is just a part of what it's gonna take to break down these broken ass systems and make change happen. That's the optimist in me. The realist also knows that it isn't gonna be easy. And so, yeah. I'm going on Yeah, it is a thing, and it is a thing, and I'm going on a bit of a rampage, and it's really easy for me to say this and feel this and see all of this as a white woman, right? And there's so many white people out there that are very much feeling these feelings in big, big ways. Whereas here in the United States, this kind of thing has been happening since we began, from the natives being abused and murdered, and raped and kicked off the land that they were tending uh all the way through to today. So it's a big conversation.

Emotional Reality And Ancestral Fatigue

SPEAKER_02 4:47

I think it's important to recognize that this country was founded um abominably, and so there has never been any kind of reconciliation um for the abominations that have have occurred. And uh in many in many um cultures, there has to be some kind of atonement in order to move on. And atonement really hasn't been a thing. And I'm not just talking about black Americans in the United States, like you mentioned before, we're talking about Native Americans as well, who you know have been here and where the United States has not abided by one single treaty that any nation, any Native American nation that they entered into. They have not followed it. They broke every single one. So when you talk about coming from that kind of a background, it's not um, it's not unbelievable at all to understand why we're here in this position, right? Why you have black and bone people being snatched and kidnapped out of the streets that they are, their communities, right? Um law-abiding citizens being kidnapped and killed, right? This is this is par for the course for this country. So it's um while, you know, we kind of touched on this a little bit earlier, while um many folks are feeling uh empowered and um want to want to do things so their voices are heard, which is completely understandable. There's many of us who are unmotivated, who have a lack of enthusiasm, who feel I wouldn't quite say apathetic, but I would just because that's also disinterest. Like there's interest there, but there is an exhaustion level that has just reached its pinnacle height because um dot dot dot all the all the things that I just kind of talked about. And how it's challenging to um regulate those emotions that you're feeling, right? Uh everything like you were saying before, from rage and confusion and fear to this here we are again type of sensation that we don't see.

SPEAKER_00 7:14

Yeah, I can imagine where the exhaustion piece is is pretty big and ancestrally, like yeah, you know, when your people who have been oppressed, abused, murdered, and all of that for the whole time. Fighting this fight, right?

SPEAKER_02 7:33

And fighting this fight to to just be able to exist and exist um equally, and so um and that have a right to be here and a right to live without fear, um, and a right to be a part of and add to this country because we are a part of it. Um, and again, I'm not speaking just for black people, I'm speaking of the whole um BIPOC community. So that's for those who aren't familiar with the term, that's black, indigenous, and people of color. So I think it is a fight that we're very, very familiar with. And some folks are like, I'm just gonna sit this one out and observe and see where this leads us. And there's some people like peace out. You've got the expat community then that is increasing um by leaps and bounds as well. So I I think I think it is important to um to fight the good fight, but I also understand the feeling of exhaustion and um anxiety and exhaustion that has come to to a lot of folks.

SPEAKER_00 8:42

Yeah, what an like just sitting here in the middle of this talk with you, I'm like, wow, we have such very different rooted perspectives, similar alignment, right? But like Again, I'm a European white woman in the United States. You know, you are a black woman, and and I haven't had to deal with this ancestrally, right? Like it's it's it's I am that person that's like, hey, I am a rebel, damn it, and I want to make change happen, right? I want to come out and I want to do what I can to save the world while I feel all of these feelings of of rage and upsetness, while also knowing that I can burn myself out quickly in doing that. And in order for me to be able to do what I feel I'm called here to do, I need to find a way to regulate that, a way to also support myself so that I can support others more deeply. Um Yeah. So how do we do that? Ready? How do we, of course, what's that?

SPEAKER_02 9:52

Literally, of course. I mean, I do think it's a time where we need to emphasize the importance of nerve. I think it's a time that we also need to emphasize the importance of adaptogens, right? Because there's a resilience to stress um that is necessary in order to just exist, is um is imperative to to kind of manage all of these feelings. And I think that one of the things that would be beneficial is for people to understand some of those um those herbs in order to to protect themselves and to have some kind of self-care so that they can, if they're opting to go out and fight the good fight, that they will have more resilience to be able to do so, that they will have, you know, a little bit better of a regulated nervous system in order to do so. And I think that's where you start. You start with the foundations of health, which of course is your diet, and is of course with your exercise. Don't forget to to your sleep. Um, those are things that are definitely foundational. And then building upon that, I think herbally there's a several layers of protection that you can um, you know, uh incorporate into your life to then get to the next layer, which is, you know, um ironically, a fight or flight type of response that people are having, right? It's it's one or the other that we're kind of um forced to to decide what we're gonna do with.

SPEAKER_00 12:30

Yeah, that fight or flight, it's exactly what it is, right? Fight, flight or freeze, right? Yeah. Yeah, I think I see that happening like collectively as we're looking on social media, whatever channels you may be in, the conversation is there and it is loud, right? And it's very loud right now, which it needs to be. Um, so yeah. And let me just before we start talking about herbs. For anybody who's out there that's like, oh, don't make this political, it is. That's all. Um, I'm just gonna leave that right there. But everything is. Yeah, everything is. So the I know that, yes, lifestyle, diet, making sure you're getting adequate amounts of sleep, making sure that you're getting enough exercise. For me, the deepest change maker every single time is stepping out in nature. Um, and you know, if you don't have the ability to go outside and walk in the woods and walk among a meadow or whatever it may be, you know, do you have plants that are near you? Do you have a plant in your home that you can just observe or connect with? That is really important for me. I know that's essential. And then yes, go ahead.

SPEAKER_02 13:47

I think, well, I was gonna say, I think I'm writing it down, but I don't need to because I'm gonna say it right now. I think a lot of times it's also it's challenging um in the winter. And I'm not sure how many folks are not uh in this the northern hemisphere, and you know, you're maybe have a summer vibe going on right now. And if you do, lucky you. Um not a winter person, so it's very challenging. Um, but also, so you could plant obviously, and also access to sunlight, right? It's it is there's much less, but winter solstice is past, so now we've got the days are getting longer. Yeah. When it comes to the sun. Um, and that is a constant for us right now. And so getting some sunlight, I think, in addition to um, I do think it it is very fascinating to um interact with plants, like you said. And it can be just, it doesn't have to be herbs, right? It could be as you're going out to your car to go to work, or you're walking to the bus station to go to work, or you're walking your kids to school, or God, if you're walking the kids to school now, I'm so sorry because it is cold out there. Of Mineraland, this week is is like the week from hell. It is like I don't okay. This is a sidebar. I'm gonna say this. This can be edited out, maybe people say hell, like in general, the theoretical hell is like hot, right? To me, it's cold. It is cold as hell. So um, you know, being able to walk and be out in the sunshine, no matter, you know how much of it there there is, um, the open air and noticing and being aware of what's around you. If you're able to be in that moment, um, it is extremely it's actually a form of meditation, right? Living in that moment of recognizing and being aware of and saying it. You could say it out loud, like, damn, it's cold. Enough. It is right now, I believe it is. So I go by Celsius, so it's negative three degrees Celsius. So that is obviously below freezing. So you're talking about in the uh 20s, right? Uh Fahrenheit. And it's but but making that observation, right? And looking at the the trees that have new leaves on them and the bushes that are covered by the snow and the tracks that you may see in the snow. Um, you know, these are things that bring your awareness to what's going on right now. And it kind of interrupts a pattern of dysregulation and kind of grounds you a little bit. And that's a really that's one of those foundations that I didn't mention, but it is a foundational part of health, is just taking a moment to ground yourself, center yourself, get some sunlight, get some fresh air. That's one of those things that I think is integral. It's good that you brought it up, but like going outside is is is a good part.

SPEAKER_00 16:32

Yeah, it's it's imperative for me. Yeah, I another thing that really helps me a lot is just breath. The breath. Taking a moment to just breathe. And obviously, there's about 510 different breath work modalities and ways to do it, but it can be as simple as just like stop whatever you're doing and observe your breath. Close your eyes, observe your breath, just take the time to do that for like 30 seconds. It's free, it's effective, it's very powerful. I love the like breathe in for the count of four and hold it at the top, and then to exhale out of my mouth for the count of eight. That's another favorite for me that really, really helps. Or when I'm exhale exhaling to let out an audible, how yeah. Like when I let that audible out, I mean, you just saw me do it. My head just like rolled all soft, and my shoulders dropped down, and I'm just giving my nervous system a moment to be. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 17:41

The audible sigh is awesome. The uncle uh releasing of your shoulders, and for me, a big one is unclinching my jaw, right? That's another big one that I don't realize that I'm sitting there with like the strength of steel going on with my jaw, and I'm like, you know, oh, I've got this very clinched feeling and being able to just unclinch.

Nervines 101: Types And Uses

SPEAKER_00 18:04

It's very, very helpful. We hold a lot of tension there, that's for sure. In the shoulders, in the face, all over. I mean, yeah. Yeah. So um, I think as we go through like this, again, I I feel like we're in s for a pretty wild ride moving forward. Uh, we can't say what's going to happen. We don't know, but we all have some intuition and some thoughts and feelings on it. But I think it's gonna be pretty challenging. And um, I'm a big, big believer that we need an herbalist in every home. I'm a big, big believer that the more people that learn to use plants as medicine, the better off our entire planet will be. Because plants, they're living beings. And the more people connect with them, the more people recognize like these actually are heal, here to heal us, the more we deepen our connection with nature, with our planet, which needs a whole heck of a lot of love. And so that's kind of been a driving force for me in this entire herbal journey that I've been on since the 90s is to inspire more people to love the planet and therefore love herbs and, you know, kind of a big recycling symbol of the whole process there. And so yes, these tools we've just talked about are great ones to help us stay strong and resilient as we go through what can be very, very challenging times. And of course, we have herbs. And like Brittany was starting to talk about earlier, where she was mentioning nervines and adaptogen herbs. And I feel like now is a good time to talk about some of the nerves that could help people. Um, when we talk about nervines, there's a couple of categories that you can think of. One, you have sedating nervines. So these are like sedating, heavily sedating. We're gonna have things like valerian or even opium. Oh, those are very, very sedating. We also have more calm. What's that? I said hops. Yeah, hops. Happy, but it's fat. Yeah, absolutely. If you can't sleep, that'll help for sure. We also have more gentle nerve and you know, I I consider chamomile to be a gentle one. Some people may like really fall asleep easily with chamomile. Um, we have nervine trophorestoratives, right? And these are gonna be herbs that help to nourish and restore balance to the entire system and help that system to perform an optimal function. So we'll get into these here in just a moment. And then we have our nervine stimulants. I have one every day, at least one cup. And coffee is one of those. So, like our caffeinated kinds of things are nervines. They're acting on the nervous system. They are stimulating, right? And then we have our whole category of adaptogens. If you're listening to this, I know you've heard about adaptogens before. I talk about them a lot. Um, they're very popular out in the world because they help our bodies adapt to various kinds of stress, body, mind, spirit, soul, what have you. They're also going to be the ones that are going to give us the strength and resilience from the inside out to maintain throughout whatever challenging times are ahead of us.

SPEAKER_02 21:23

Brittany, did I do okay on that? Those explanations haven't you? Absolutely. And in the category of adaptogens, like that's a whole category with subcategories in and of itself, because you have your stimulating adaptogens as well. You have your modulating adaptogens. Um, you have, well, they're all modulants, I guess I should say, but uh ones that are not as stimulating. Um, I wouldn't quite say sedative, but they're not as stimulating as something like rhodiola, which can be stimulating or something like um, what's another stimulating? Oh, ginseng for sure. A stimulating adaptogen. Um, so and I I love adaptogens. And what I love about them is the um the I hate using this term as an herbalist that really likes science and because I think I get mis uhunderstood, but I love the magic of adaptogens. I love how scientifically they've proven to be very effective, but they're like, yeah, we don't quite know how this works. This, you know, emphasis or this balancing of the, you know, knowing when if you're in a hyper situation too much, it's gonna give you, it's gonna bring you down a little bit. If you're in a hypo, like where you're uh you're redu you have reduced capacity of something, it's gonna be more um uh, I don't want to say stimulating, because I just said that there may be some that are not stimulating, but it's gonna bring you up to where you need to be. It's so balancing, but they're not sure how it works. And I love that that magic that just has which to me, magic is just science that hasn't been explained yet. They just don't have the the data to back it up. But that is what is so fascinating to me about adapted gen. And so I really love working with them, which you know, I'm working with my favorite one right here. This is Tulsi that I grew in my garden. Which I consider a mild like Tulsi's my best friend. I cannot talk about it enough. Also sipping on Tulsi. Yeah. And I just saw you taking a tincture of the tincture right here.

SPEAKER_00 23:27

My tincture is Ashwagandha.

unknown 23:29

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 23:30

My other one is um you can't see it is and I think you were talking about it what you might have had in your mind when you were talking about uh trofe restoratives restoratives um Milky Oats.

SPEAKER_00 23:42

I thought that I'm like reading your mind in the moments. Yeah. Okay. You and I are well stopped, obviously.

unknown 23:51

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 23:51

We live, breathe, and are this herbal world. I know mine's over there, but and out there. I have multiple large apothecary shelf spaces, but I just break it down. Let's start with like I feel like let's start with some nervings because from my perspective, like if I'm working with somebody, they come to me, I know we're gonna really create some type of long-term plan for that individual. But nobody comes to you and says, hey herbalist, can you help me and make sure I feel better in three months? Yeah. I mean it's our job to explain to them that it's a long-term game, but they want they want something now. And I would imagine that there's a lot of us out there, myself included, that are like, how can I feel better now?

SPEAKER_01 24:44

How can I find a sense of calm now? I think do you want me to get specific? Yeah, bring it.

SPEAKER_02 24:54

I think right now too um often used um are skull cap and passion flower. I like Passion Flower more, but only because it is rampant in my yard. It is choking out everything. It is it is it is killing the tomatoes that I grow over the summer. Those little lovely curly cues on Passion Flower, which kind of follows a little bit of the doctrine of signatures, right? Where it's like good for their the circular thoughts and those little curly cue vines. Tendrils yeah tendrils they those suckers just latch on to everything and just cut and it's cute at first. You think oh the first time passion flower spontaneously popped up in my garden I was like as the herbalist to me totally kicked that was like oh my God Lamont this is passionflower. This is awesome don't touch it. That's a huge mistake. I found a huge mistake and now it's literally everywhere. I would pull in the summer I probably pull up six or seven shoots of passion flower a day a day. That is an racious herb like my God but it is super effective um and I like working with it for just the the it you just can't shut the brain off for a second. Just give me a give me a minute of peace and Passionflower I think is really effective and skullcat both of those um are I believe um in my um work that I've done with clients and the blends that I make um both of those are tend to be really effective especially for more acute situations rather than adaptatives which is more of a chronic situation.

Linden’s Embrace And Cardiovascular Support

SPEAKER_00 26:35

Yeah I I love those two as well for me they're pretty darn sedating. So those are herbs that I turn to when it's time to go to bed and they help me. You know I'm 47. I'm at that typical age where 3 a.m and everybody's up on threads right now going who else is up plus awake right now. And yeah it really helps with those racing thoughts in the middle of the night when we've got so much going on and you just cannot stay in that solid state of sleep. That's how it helps for me. And yes, I could see where that's really important for some people that are in that incredibly stressed and burnt out state. And herb that's really helpful for me in times like these that I can also go throughout my day and be like cool I'm able to function. I'm able to do the things Lyndon is is my magic like I love Tilia and I love it also because it's so beneficial for cardiovascular health as well um but for me like I just I can say I I've said this before on this podcast and my students definitely know it but Lyndon is this plant I'm saying its name right now and I see this big beautiful tree and I see its big branches embracing me and holding me and hugging me and squeezing all the stress away as it's like whispering to me with its soft little demulson lovely flowers and saying it's okay Belle. Whatever you're going through right now is going to be okay. And so like tomorrow one of the women in my community is holding a gathering to stay in community and support one another and it's a potluck but I have a basketball game to coach but I'm gonna just drop off a couple of pots of Linden tea for the party just to to give some big herbal hugs to people.

SPEAKER_02 28:43

So I'm Linden love one of the things I like about Linden well short story I have a there's a tree a neighbor of mine has a Linden tree in their yard and as I'm walking and I see it and I'm like the weird person in the neighborhood I'm like hey can I can I come flowers it's and I get these huge I mean he was like yeah please go for it uh and then ask what do you use it for which was a great opportunity for me to geek out um but what I love about about Linden is that it's cooling right and a lot of nervines tend to be drying and so Linden oftentimes brings a nice balance to it when you're talking about um you know really trying to balance formulas that you're making and so to me um Linden works really well for that like it it's not only um supportive when it comes to your nerves right but it also helps to to bring a little bit of a of a cooling um feeling to to your body yeah absolutely I remember my first time nibbling on a a fresh linen flower after I had just taken it from the cute little bees bumbling all around it and just feeling the demolcent qualities in that flower on my tongue like it was really lovely.

SPEAKER_00 30:12

Very moistening very cooling very very lovely. So I love that you bring that up as a as an ability to balance out a form. Yeah I think there's chamomile in there you know that's the one that's always thrown out and valid what a great herb. Yeah what an incredibly underrated herb.

SPEAKER_02 30:36

Definitely gonna help in times when our nervous system is fried among so many other ways that chamomile can help a being yeah I um I always use uh chamomile as a as an example um as like a uh an herb that people say is overhyped and I'm like people talk about it a lot but there's a reason like it is it's such a great herb to work with um for so many different reasons I love the antispasmodic qualities of chamomile so you know when you've got that tension the muscle tension and the stress and kind of like things going on you know muscle wise especially in your neck chamomile can be great or your stomach really more so your stomach I don't know why I say neck because that too but your stomach you know that peristalsis that happens when in your stomach when you you your stomach is like no no I don't think so I'm not I'm not having this and I'm gonna I'm gonna let you know.

Chamomile, Lemon Balm, Rose, And Hawthorn

SPEAKER_00 31:34

Chamomile is a great turn too absolutely and it's so like the connection there it's there's always the stories I love to share of my daughter and her connection with chamomile and in the earlier years how she would just pick out the chamomile flowers from my cups of tea and eat them like like they were chamomile candy and then she just kind of became prone to anxious feeling. She's a big big big big feeler and um chamomile was has just always been the herb for her to the point that now I can just tell her I'm making a cup of tea and she like I feel with the linden tree hugging me. She's like okay I'm better. Oh even without the tea so I think that's that is magic. Yeah it's got great aroma too like that smell just I'm like yeah please put my nose in a jar of chamomile all day every day sounds great.

SPEAKER_02 32:30

Okay so yes Linden skull cap passion flower chamomile obviously there are so many other great plants we can work uh uh with like you were speaking about winter and not liking winter um not liking the lack of sunshine that makes me think a lot about lemon balm and its antidepressive properties and its ability to kind of uplift the spirits also known as nature's sunshine I think that's a really appropriate one right now actually in my tea right now is Tulsi lemon balm and rosemary I thought you were gonna say rose which I find to be another good one but rosemary that's great because yeah I got a long lot more hours left in my day I mean that rosemary um but yeah rose is on my mind as well and what another lovely one do you want to chat or or share a few little ditties on Rose I love Rose um for for so many reasons so when I formulate I use it as like the spark the little burst of floral flavor but it adds so much for the like emotional and physical heart like the the relaxing um calming just um it's just beautiful to work with and I like working with it because you can do work with it on so many levels right so you can work with the herb and a tea you it's a beautiful smokable herb um it is a beautiful uh makes a great oil like an infused oil we won't get into the essential oil because you just might as well mortgage your house up uh because that's just no you can go for an absolute so that's a little bit more um manageable but it's just um such a beautiful herb to work with and and I've but but on the other hand a little dabble do you like you don't you don't need to go crazy with it because it does have a strong floral um fragrance and flavor to it so you don't need a lot and you but what's magical about it is that you don't need a lot for it to be effective. And so that's one of the the reasons why I like um using rose so much. I use it a lot of formulas that I make.

SPEAKER_00 34:53

Yeah I feel like rose like it usually calls to me when we're dealing with grief or just heartache, right? And and along with Rose, another pairing I love to bring in also in the Rose family is Hawthorne and both of them have their thorns to protect and maintain some boundaries right um I think about Hawthorne and opening the heart to giving and receiving of love and supporting people when they are grieving when they are going through hard times. And I think a lot of people right now are feeling various levels of grief. Yeah absolutely so those can be super helpful like right there we just gave you so many those herbs that's a lot of them not all of them are going to be the one for you you know that's always an important thing to remember but let's let's talk about like so those are our our herbs that are going to help right now. And let's chat about some of the herbs that also help right now but build that strength and reserve resilience necessary for the long haul yeah we're in for a long fight here. Absolutely and those are our adaptogenic herbs right again like I mentioned already those are herbs that are there to help us adapt to life's various stressors which there are so many mentally physically spiritually in all of the ways and one of my greatest go-tos for me other than Tulsi I also put Tulsi in the nerving category very much so um but ashwagandha is isn't bestie for me when I ran my product line and I was just so busy all the time because I thought I had to do all of it all of it and other people couldn't do it for me I was burnt out and I would abuse ashwagandha quite frankly in like relying on it to help me have that resilience and strength and it did it did it really well to the point that like I would take my ashwagandha on a regular basis but if I forgot to take my ashwagandha for a week or two those were the times when I was like I can't tell you and then I'd be like where's my ashwagandha and I would take like a little squirt of the tincture and I'd be like oh my friend I love you I love you thank you for having my back and giving me some stability and foundation and this is really minimizing the power of ashwagandha in this talk but this is how it it really was for me still is to this day. It is also an herb that is an herb that you want to take for a longer duration right most of our adaptogens are that way. They are not a quick kind of grab me thing. I think I've developed that relationship with ashwagandha though where I can like I was talking about Lyndon I can talk about it I can touch it I can taste it and I can be like oh yeah I am supported I am supported that sensory feeling is is important there too.

Adaptogens For The Long Haul

SPEAKER_02 38:13

I find you know definitely adaptogens are not it's not for an acute um situation. This is for um resiliency this is for recovery this is for um like you said the long haul you know a lot of times with the many different adaptogens you're talking about four to six weeks before you start to notice oh you know wow okay hold on I do start to see something you know I am starting to see some differences in how I'm managing this stress level um and I like to to think about adaptogens as um as a support that is not uh you know you can there's there's cool there's different um uh categories like we were talking about earlier in terms of those that are recommended that you could like Tulsi where you can you know drink it every day for the rest of your life and you'll be you know happy happy and you know um good to go.

SPEAKER_00 39:09

And then there's others where kind of an on and off type of um of dosage if you will is is is best or on and off um what's the word I'm looking for um you take it for three months you don't specifically I forgot when it's I it's also on the tip of my tongue and not coming out. So but that's the layman's terms of it.

SPEAKER_02 39:35

Yeah that's the point you get what I mean you get what I absolutely think my favorite after Tulsi would be well right now I've got Cesandra and goji berry that I'm I'm uh it's like I have little goji berries in my tea right now so many flavors I know so the goji berry isn't much until because I have it in here until I drink it so it has a very underlined taste but the Cezandra for those who aren't familiar with Cezandra it's also known as like the five spice berry I love using Cezandra because it is such an incredible um incredibly potent pungent like berry like the it really does have those five flavors.

Tulsi, Ashwagandha, Schisandra, And Reishi

SPEAKER_00 40:31

It is really tart it is sour it is bitter it is all of these things all at once it's everything everywhere all at once it is really kind of is amazing um so I really like working with Shizandra yeah among all of its amazing benefits the flavors are also a wild ride I love that um I think Rishi during this time as well the uh what is it Lingji the mushroom of life the immortal mushroom it used to be known as but a very very beneficial adaptogen I will say there's a lot of uh crappy mushroom products out on the market so be mindful of where you are sourcing your mushroom products for what from it's a whole nother podcast episode to talk about yeah right sourcing is important and with your I mean with your quality over quantity is definitely um you know a rule to live by when it comes with your your herbs. All day every day I actually before this call with Brittany I was on a call with the Sustainable Herbs initiative and um it was quite a delight to be on that call. It's run by this woman named Anne Ombrecht and I hope I said her last name right it's spelled kind of challenging to pronounce but Anne's amazing she has been doing the work to ensure that supply chain transparency is there throughout the herbal industry. And uh when I ran Mountain Mells and I had my apothecary and even before I had my apothecary she had this beautiful film that she and her husband put together called Newman and it was all about you know the the plants and sustainability and making sure that these plants are here for future generations. And anyways I used to show her film in my apothecary like back in 2010 well in the library in 2010 later in my apothecary and anyways a side note totally not relevant to the topic aside from your sourcing your herbs from reputable companies that give a damn about the plants and the planet and the people that's all that's a horse I will ride on for the rest of my life so yeah um I want these herbs to be here for if I am fortunate enough to have grandbabies I want them there for the grandbabies and and forever you know we need to be more mindful as as the herbal world continues to boom and boost in such exponential ways. Yeah. What else? Well you know I think the herbs that we just talked about most of them are going to be pretty darn safe and beneficial for your average person bringing herbal medicine into their home which is really really important. And I think we might have some people on here who really are feeling this call and this desire to support their communities in a deeper way in a way that goes beyond the surface level herbalism. And when I say surface level herbalism I'm talking about the information that's out on social media. I'm talking about the you know the fix all oh valerian is the sleep herb so there you go you can't sleep I'm giving everybody valerian yeah yeah valeric and then it can be stimulating for some like not exactly right right and and you know there's the people that do want to support and want to help and they want to work with plants and they want to make this change and this shift and and you know how do we because you and I are those people we have been those people for so long and we are very much human. So how do we also go into this work balancing the need to support ourselves while we simultaneously want to support those in our community yeah so like the practice what you preach type of situation and that's a thing.

SPEAKER_02 44:50

I think it's really easy you know you mentioned burnout earlier when we started and I think that um it's really easy um as those who are are are out here in the community doing the things to not realize that our own self care is a

SPEAKER_01 45:09

Priority. And so that's a thing. It is. It's a big thing.

SPEAKER_00 45:17

And so basically, do everything we just said as you also help guide other people to that to do those things.

SPEAKER_02 45:24

Yeah. Yeah. Taking the time to to to question, like, where am I right now? How am I feeling? Am I am I like I think for me, I when people say for me personally, but for me, personally, when when um I don't realize when I'm in the thick of things, I don't realize that I'm overwhelmed. And so having being able to take some time for some self-reflection is necessary for me. Because if I don't, I'll just keep going and keep going and not understand like, God, why am I so tired? Why is my skin breaking out? Why do I feel like crap? Gosh, yeah, I don't like ding ding ding. Honestly, the bells do not ring. I it could be, I can see it in somebody else, and I'd be like, oh, well, this, this, and this, and this and this and this will be helpful. And, you know, you need to do X, Y, and Z. And for me, you know, don't see it at all. Not a clue. And so I have to have some time for self-reflection and be like, oh, I do feel tightness all over my body. Oh, I have been waking up with headaches every morning. You know, those kinds of things in order for me to make sure that I'm taking care of myself. Otherwise, it ain't good.

SPEAKER_00 46:43

Yeah. I I see that, feel that, have lived that numerous times because I uh I remember being a child thinking I was invincible. Like literally, like I'm invincible. Not just like, you know, the crazy kid that's gonna go out and do all things, but not consciously thinking they're invincible. Turns out they're not.

SPEAKER_01 47:04

I've discovered shocker.

Quality, Sourcing, And Sustainability

SPEAKER_00 47:08

A bit literal. But yes, that time for self-reflection. It's funny that you mentioned that as you were talking about how, you know, when you're in the middle of it and you don't recognize that you're overwhelmed. And it brings me to two times recently, like within the last month of my life. One, when we were experiencing some pretty intense flooding in my backyard. I I live on this beautiful mountain river, and like I am fascinated by mother nature and weather patterns and all these cool things. And we had no power for a few days. And so, like, my little neighborhood was totally dark, and this wild mountain river decided to jump up over the bank and was running directly through. Like, I have my my backyard is elevated up from the river, and then there's like a little uh wooded area that you have to go through before you get to what is normally the river. And we have like a mini little pond at the bottom of the back lake of the backyard that is not a pond at all in the summertime, right? You you know it's a it's a water space of sorts. Anyways, said water space became an actual rushing river through my entire neighborhood. And like Chris and I are out, it is just crapping rain on our heads, and we've got all our rain gear on, and we're still soaked, and we're outside with flashlights because there's no power in our entire neighborhood, and we are walking around checking out all this flooding, like, wow, this is so cool. Like, this is amazing taking videos, like wow, and like the next day and the day after. It's like, oh my God. I'm exhausted. It was also like right in prime time for holiday celebrations, like the next day, and they had to go down to visit my family. And so there's that edition on it all. And I like remember reflecting back to Chris, like, wow, that was really cool to see and experience. And I am now exhausted because of all the energy that gets spent there, like in the moment. Wow, this is so cool! Well, wait, wait. I am overwhelmed. Yeah. And then I can also relate that to this weekend, like Saturday morning, when I woke up and I woke up and and saw the videos of Alex's death and murder. And I spiraled in that for a while. And uh eventually I made myself go outside where I could find some peace and some sanity. But spiraling in those kinds of scenarios and situations, like it's a it's a fine balance between awareness of what is happening and the ability to maintain your sanity. Yeah. Yeah. And I think that for me is oftentimes a struggle. And when I take the time to reflect on that, like, okay, you see what is happening right now in the world. You also see what is happening with you. And you are a being, I am a being who really does have a lot of passion for making a difference in this world and helping people on a greater scale. But if I'm not taking those times to reflect, to get outside, to bring on the herbs that are going to help me best, then I am of no damn good for anyone else. That's yeah.

SPEAKER_02 50:37

Yeah, no, it's it's imperative, you know, um, that we take that moment. Otherwise, we're not I mean, it's you know, it is akin to the the exhausted example of the um airplane air mask like you know, put on yours before you, you know, try and save your baby. And it's like duh, I'm gonna save my baby first, and then you die.

SPEAKER_01 51:09

That was one example of politics. Thanks for coming to the everybody.

SPEAKER_00 51:19

Oh, truth though. There is so much truth in that.

SPEAKER_02 51:22

Yeah, yeah, right, you know, so we gotta make sure that we're taking care of ourselves. And you know what? I think here's another good part. Um for those like myself that uh don't realize that that I'm running on empty, um, and you know, I'm just just puttering away, thinking everything is, you know, hunky-dory, um, is to have somebody that will be like, hey, your tank light is on and it's been on for a good minute. I think you need to take a moment. Um, that's really important too, because otherwise, again, it ain't good. So, you know, having a good um friend, partner that recognizes those signs in you, and you may have to tell them. Like, you know, some some other folks are just as clueless. They think you are just fine. And so you may need to say, you know, hey, this is what I believe it looks like when I am spiraling. So lay me back in before I start to just, you know, before I melt them to the floor.

SPEAKER_00 52:29

Yeah, absolutely. And I love how you say that because my partner and I have been together almost 16 years. And just recently, in like the last couple of weeks, maybe since flood time, he has actually been using the words of like, I'll be like, oh, I want, I'm gonna keep doing this. Like right now, I work a part-time job, Burn Herb Company, I run the herbaliz path, and I coach middle school girls basketball five days a week. You aren't barely doing anything. I'm like, I'm bored. It's one way to put it. But recently, like, I'm like, oh, well, I need to paint the doors for my office and rearrange my office, and I need to do this and do that, and blah, blah, blah. And I have recently heard him say, no, you shouldn't do that. You should just like go outside so you don't get burnt out. Yeah. And this has come up multiple times in the past coming past month or so. And I'm like, oh my gosh. And I just stated this to him last week. Was like, hey, thanks for recognizing that like I need to take care of myself to naturally, and for stating that to me. Like, hey, just like you said, like, hey, here's your warning flag. I see you. Thank you.

SPEAKER_02 53:39

And good for you to actually listen because I have been also that person who's like, I'm fine, I'm great. I don't need to take a break right now. I'm fine. I'm just gonna power through this. Also, stubborn.

SPEAKER_01 53:50

Yeah. Not gonna be. Yeah.

Caring For Self While Caring For Others

SPEAKER_02 53:54

And I have learned in my wisened age that um, yeah, listen, listen, folks, they may they may have something going on up there. Yeah, absolutely. Especially a partner, because mine, again, it's a ridiculous amount of time that we've been together. It's been almost 30 years, so yeah, he knows me. He knows me. So he knows me. Probably better than you do.

SPEAKER_01 54:16

Probably. I love that.

SPEAKER_00 54:19

I love that. And for something, some reason, like his name Lamont, it just makes me happy. And every time I hear you say his name, I'm like, oh, I bet he's just adorable.

SPEAKER_02 54:28

Oh, he's adorable, all right. It's so funny because we say his okay, so there's two, this is I'm gonna keep this short, I promise, and of course you can cut it out. There's two things that we um play fight over. Number one, he thinks because he took a year in French in high school, that like he has the the I don't know, whatever on anything that sounds French, including his name, Lamont. It's like Le Mont. I'm like, okay. And he'll be like, and croissant. He is one of those people that has to say croissant, like, okay, okay, just stop. There's that, and the fact that he thinks he's southern when he is not. Born in Washington, D.C., he's not so I mean, yes, it is considered a little bit more southern, but you're not southern, honey. It's okay. I was born in North Carolina, I'm Southern.

SPEAKER_01 55:14

I still love Jack. I hate you, buddies. That was a whole tangent.

SPEAKER_00 55:22

And a funny one. And a funny one. Speaking of tangents and funny people and learning about herbs and and guides and and people that have been there. For those of you that do not know, Brittany and I are co-educators in a community herbalist mentorship and certification program. While the certification comes from us, there is no like overall certifying board here in the United States, but we are you do a lot of the work that is going to equip you to be successful in serving your community in the future, serving your family and understanding herbal medicine beyond the surface level stuff, right? Understanding how to work with different body systems and structures and how to pair an herb with a particular situation or formulate on a deeper level for an individual that may need it. So we do that together.

SPEAKER_02 56:18

I was going to just say keeping in mind things like energetics and in the synergy of herbs and how they work together, which is, you know, um not as intuitive as as one may think. A lot of times it can be, but usually that intuitiveness comes from experience and with the herbs and working with um with people. And so that's what we bring to this is that experience.

SPEAKER_00 56:43

So absolutely. Like obviously, I'm a huge proponent of books and knowledge and education. And while we give you loads of knowledge and education in the program, understanding the systems, understanding different disease states and how to figure out how to work with those with various situations that may have caused said disease states. What I think is most important is the ability to have somebody with experience that you can come to and say, Hey, this happened. What can I do right now? And we won't necessarily be like, do this right now. My approach is more like, let me challenge you to think of this in another angle so that you can come up with this answer on your own, because you have all the information.

SPEAKER_02 57:30

Get ready to get, I won't say frustrated because it's not frustrating, but you know how some folks answer a question with a question? Yeah, that's what we're gonna do. We're gonna qu we're gonna question your question.

SPEAKER_00 57:41

Challenge you to think. Uh uh. Absolutely. Anyways, we have that for you if you are feeling that call to serve your community on a deeper level, to deepen your herbal skills and your confidence with herbal medicine. Because I think, at least for me in the beginning, when I first started learning about herbs, it was super duper exciting. And I was like, yeah, all the herbs and all the things. And then I would learn more and more and be like, oh, this is deeper than what I think, you know.

SPEAKER_01 58:11

That's what we help you through, is that deeper part.

SPEAKER_00 58:16

Anyways, any other parting words of wisdom on this happy episode? Yeah, it was a happy episode.

SPEAKER_01 58:24

Um yeah. Laugh more. I love laughing. Yeah, right.

SPEAKER_02 58:31

I mean, I it's under it's underrated, right? Like laughing is really fun and good. And try and, you know, unfortunately, I can't recommend. Well, there are some herbs that can help you laugh more, but um that's a different podcast.

SPEAKER_01 58:44

So on that next episode with Brittany and Mel. Laughable herbs and such. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_00 58:57

Well, I'm super excited to bring you on for more episodes. It makes it so much more fun for me to talk about herbs with another friend and share the wonders of plant medicine. So yeah, thanks for being here. Thanks for having me. And listeners, thank you too. Have a great day. Thank you so much for joining me on this episode of the Herbalist Path. If you're loving this journey into herbal medicine, please follow and review the show. It helps more people find their own path with the plants. And if you know someone who could use this kind of support, please share this episode with them. So that way we can keep making herbalism spread like wildflowers. Also, a gentle reminder nothing shared on this podcast is intended to diagnose, treat, or cure any disease. This is all for educational purposes, and yeah, a little entertainment too. But it is not a substitute for personalized care from a qualified health practitioner. Always do your own research, listen to your body, and when needed, partner with a trusted professional who honors both your intuition and your unique health journey. Until next time, take care, stay curious, and keep walking the herbalist path.